Tulpa.info - tulpa-questions-2

Yes cerys! Will andrew look like a ghost. When manefested

11:45 PM

Will he be able to hug me

11:46 PM

When someone creates a tulpa how will i get them to a mind of there own

11:47 PM

Can it be based off of someone

11:47 PM

Thanks

11:47 PM

And will saying his name help to

11:53 PM

By the way this community is awsome everyone is so friendly so far

yeah....

@JSheerXeno54 :)

hm?

There is a lot to answer there Ryan3665, perhaps the content of a whole forum itself. I can give you some short responses that can be elaborated on by myself or others, however it would probably be good to stick to one question at a time if you want any real depth to them. Imposition, seeing your tulpa as though they are visible with your eyes can take a long time to do. Some people spend years working on impostion/projection alone but it is possible. I think many people report being able to hear and feel their tulpa before they are able to see them, although of course working on seeing them in your minds eye can come sooner. In essence feeling them is akin to a somatic hallucination - something that we all do from time to time, but much more controlled with practise. There are no limitations on who or what your tulpa looks like short of your imagination, similarly with their personality although with the latter I would advise choosing broader qualities rather than specific clones. A tulpa as it develops may well diverge from your own preferences and explore its own personality and make changes to the way it looks. Just like we cannot will a child to become as we want it to be - we can offer guidance and support to help it. Speaking to your tulpa is often part of what is called "forcing". It isnt as aggresive as it sounds rather it means spending time with them, imagining them and their qualities.

@Fel thank you so much!!!!!

12:07 AM

Will I see shadows or something like that when it gets to that point

12:08 AM

How do I know when its manefested Into reality

12:09 AM

Sorry I'm just so existed to this

12:09 AM

It's all new to me

12:09 AM

Just found it out today

hm....

@Fel But its making sense slowly to me

I think the key part is to learn about them as they are inside of you first rather than what you may see - as exciting as it may be to imagine the time when you see the tulpa manifested! Some people choose to live inside the headspace or wonderland completely and never manifest. There are no people who are better than others when it comes to tulpamancy. Much of it is trial and error but it can help to talk to them, but dont be surprised if some things take longer or some things just seem to click into place. Belief is a strong factor that helps along the way, if you treat them as real and have confidence that they will become real then they will do. You are working however with your own mind, something that is composed on millions of modules of personality and aspects that make you who you are. Creating a tulpa could be described as creating many more little modules that are distinct from you that work together to become another being. They will always be a part of you, but will also be different, have their own thoughts and perceptions about what you experience together.

@Fel thank u for the helpful infoinformation T H A N K. Y O U

I'm sure others here will help you too! It can be a wonderful journey to take and help you to understand your own mind just as much. My own tulpa is called Fel and she's a lifelong companion and friend that I wouldn't be without, i hope everyone who takes up a tulpa of their own finds that too. Enjoy the process. (Im off to bed now as its either very late/ or too early o'clock.)

I've read a lot of guides, including many sections on active forcing, but I still don't fully understand it. Is active forcing necessary for sentience, does it just speed up the process, or is it different for everyone? During active forcing, do you sit down and visualise your tulpa/headspace (if you have a form/headspace) and focus on talking to them? I feel like different people have different ways of active forcing, what personally worked for you? (ik not everything will work for everyone, but just to get an idea)

Deleted User

I've read a lot of guides, including many sections on active forcing, but I still don't fully understand it. Is active forcing necessary for sentience, does it just speed up the process, or is it different for everyone? During active forcing, do you sit down and visualise your tulpa/headspace (if you have a form/headspace) and focus on talking to them? I feel like different people have different ways of active forcing, what personally worked for you? (ik not everything will work for everyone, but just to get an idea)

The difference between active and passive forcing is greatly exaggerated in my opinion, and the line can be blurry too. You absolutely can create a tulpa with just the latter. That said: Active forcing is any activity where the main goal is to interact with them rather than simply have them running in the back of your mind while you do something else - If you're not doing active forcing you're not exactly interacting with them on any kind of deep level. Imagine a relationship where someone is only ever in the periphery of your life rather than being directly interacted with - that's passive forcing. It works but basically any interaction that's meaningful is nearly always going to be closer to active forcing. The action you are describing is called narration, it doesn't actually require a form or a headspace. That's training up visualization, conversely, which is something you can do separately or together and itself counts as a form of active forcing. Narration alone quickly became too boring for me. I hate talking about inane things we already know. I can only stomach it if it has a clear purpose, which it sometimes does so we still sometimes just talk with no other purpose. Generally though, I'd much rather for instance play a TTRPG with them, or have them front and play vidya games, or do romance things - All of which are specifically things we enjoy that we can't really suggest to anyone else unless they have overlapping tastes. In short I think the best thing to do to figure out active forcing is to figure out why you want to be interacting with your tulpa, literally speaking. What do you two want to do? Find the forcing in that. It's less droll than sitting down and talking for several hours. (edited)

1

Use what you enjoy doing and find ways of incorporating them in it really. Zen I think is spot on, whilst I enjoy meditating and visualising you might not do, but i still purport its a great way to build up some mental fortitude and doesnt have to be boring! Being actively engaged with your tulpa however is important for development and there are many ways to do that.

If you're not doing active forcing you're not exactly interacting with them on any kind of deep level.

I'd say that's a significant difference

I mostly mean that there's not actually that much technical difference between the two actions. If the definition of passive forcing is doing something not-tulpa related whilst keeping them in the periphery of your mind, and the definition of active forcing is doing something directly tulpa related and focusing on them - what exactly does focusing on them primarily and doing something secondarily actually fall under? Is it passive because you're still doing something else, or is it active because it's focused around them? It's a false dichotomy, an activity can feasibly be both. Semantically though, as you say, it's relatively useful for examining what you're doing with your time and weighing value.

1

It's useful to be able to say "I'm good at both keeping my tulpa in my head regularly; and I'm also good at both the skills of tulpamancy and having a meaningful relationship with them" And to have specific practices for developing those things separately.

We agree that doing activities that are closely integrated with key aspects of your identity/sense of self can be grounding, correct?

So, if one has key deeply-held aspects of their identity/self-concept and is unable to or never engages in any of them, could that go so far as to have the opposite effect, i.e., some mild degree of dissociation? I expect I'll hear "no", but I'm still curious.

So, if one has key deeply-held aspects of their identity/self-concept and is unable to or never engages in any of them

I don't think I understand what you're talking about (edited)

By itself I would expect that to just be unpleasant - but depending on the perspective I actually think that is definitely a way to train yourself to dissociate if the mindset is "I cannot be doing this."

Oh wait like, "I really want to be an astronaut" but not being able to because you can't get the physics diploma, stuff like that?

I can't imagine why one would specifically want to train for that to happen, but the universe has an exception for everything so I am sure there is some reason.

In that case yes, "I really want to be an astronaut" is psychological (= identity-based) suffering

Unfastened Belts

Oh wait like, "I really want to be an astronaut" but not being able to because you can't get the physics diploma, stuff like that?

Maybe, except you also don't take or can't take any steps towards earning, no research, no studying, joining programs, or anything even vaguely associated with outer space.

Yeah

Well, if you want to make a wild speculative stab at DID. That might actually be how it's done in early age. The belief being "This can't be happening to me."

"I could be happy if only I was an astronaut, but I can never be an astronaut, therefore I cannot be happy." Suffering

9:12 PM

deeply-held aspects of their identity/self-concept

Beautifully put, actually

9:12 PM

It's the "deeply holding" that turns it into suffering

9:13 PM

"I need this to be a part of my life, otherwise I'm invalid" (edited)

9:14 PM

Expectation, to put it in Roger's words

Unfastened Belts

"I could be happy if only I was an astronaut, but I can never be an astronaut, therefore I cannot be happy." Suffering

So to flip it back again then, is it pleasure in having those things that makes them good for grounding?

Pleasure in having what things? Being an astronaut, or having a concept of being an astronaut?

I would say the pleasure is irrelevant - only that it reaffirms your beliefs is necessary for grounding

9:16 PM

It could be a terrible thing that you associate with your personality

9:16 PM

And that would probably still ground you

Marissa, go back to my original post. I said taking the assumption that doing things closely related to the core of your specific identity seems to be considered good for groubding--so would a complete deprivation of it potentially cause the opposite, dissociation? Pleasure and suffering are only tangentially relevant to this, I think. (edited)

I have the exact opposite viewpoint as Zen - reaffirming beliefs is the most psychologically harmful thing you can do. To keep up a false sense of who you are. False in the sense that you know you can never be an astronaut, and yet tying your validity to it (edited)

9:17 PM

Oh sorry I missed that original post

Whether it's harmful or not is also irrelevant, it's still grounding for the personality involved.

For me, the grounding is not to stop dissociation, but to feel more securely in front/stop blending

Zen

It could be a terrible thing that you associate with your personality

Agreed. So if you were completely untethered to anything that you consider as making you you start to cause a sort of detachment similar to dissociation?

Scarlet

We agree that doing activities that are closely integrated with key aspects of your identity/sense of self can be grounding, correct?

Ah okay

So not doing something tied to my identity would make me feel more blendy

I would say no

Zen

Whether it's harmful or not is also irrelevant, it's still grounding for the personality involved.

Agreed, definitely.

Doing activities that align with your preferences will be pleasant, but if your preferences have turned into "deeply held identity/self-concepts" (aka, a sense that you can only feel fulfilled if those preferences are delivered), then the moment you stop doing those activities, there will be a sense of "I need more of this because it fulfills me"

Scarlet

Agreed. So if you were completely untethered to anything that you consider as making you you start to cause a sort of detachment similar to dissociation?

It depends a lot on the mindset I think. I don't think doing things that are outside your beliefs will necessarily cause anything other than discomfort. I intentionally force myself to do such things all the time and I don't dissociate while doing so. I think you would specifically need to hold views about not being involved or related to those things.

The pleasure in engaging in those activities isn't harmful, but the more "deeply held" those preferences are, the more you come to believe that you NEED the pleasure from engaging in them

Zen

It depends a lot on the mindset I think. I don't think doing things that are outside your beliefs will necessarily cause anything other than discomfort. I intentionally force myself to do such things all the time and I don't dissociate while doing so. I think you would specifically need to hold views about not being involved or related to those things.

I don't think it's a matter of doing things unrelated to you, it's more a matter of never doing things related to you. Vixie has very little of anything that is core to herself and she is does probably the best in this regard.

9:25 PM

I feel like this probably has some term to refer to it like "unrealized identity" or something that would make it easier to try to go digging for info on.

9:26 PM

Also, thank you for the responses.

1

Scarlet

So, if one has key deeply-held aspects of their identity/self-concept and is unable to or never engages in any of them, could that go so far as to have the opposite effect, i.e., some mild degree of dissociation? I expect I'll hear "no", but I'm still curious.

It's when I get caught up doing a bunch of stuff unrelated to me that I need to ground. This happened to me today, I was too distracted and needed to change my environment and center myself

I don't think it's a matter of doing things unrelated to you, it's more a matter of never doing things related to you.

Sorry if I'm being annoying, but wouldn't the most obvious answer be, "then why relate those things to me?" (edited)

9:46 PM

The issue is not that you can't do those things, the issue is that they're being held as "deeply-held identity/self-concepts" anyway

9:47 PM

(IMO ofc)

9:48 PM

(JMO ofc)

9:49 PM

You're always going to have preferences/aversions. Turning them into deeply-held beliefs about who you are just doesn't strike me as helpful (although ofc I'm not saying you're able to avoid that from happening) (edited)

9:50 PM

I sound like such a singlet... XP

Maybe if the question was a "what should someone do" type instead of a "what happens if" type question.

Beliefs can be changed, but yes I don't think it's possible to avoid their formation. The key should be in forming beliefs that are consistent with reality, and being self-aware enough to understand that you may be wrong, and need to adjust.

Scarlet

Maybe if the question was a "what should someone do" type instead of a "what happens if" type question.

Indeed. The latter strikes me as a much more useful question to ask than the former

Well, you're free to ask that one, but it seems like you already have an answer to it that you're happy with. But it's not the question I am asking.

9:52 PM

... Does it bother you that I am curious about something else other than that same conversation that has already been pretty well expounded on here? (edited)

Zen

Beliefs can be changed, but yes I don't think it's possible to avoid their formation. The key should be in forming beliefs that are consistent with reality, and being self-aware enough to understand that you may be wrong, and need to adjust.

Definitely agreed. This probably ties closely to a similar principle that was discussed in that other channel, there should be some balance between flexibility and stability/structure. I could see extremes in either direction being an issue in this area.

Scarlet

... Does it bother you that I am curious about something else other than that same conversation that has already been pretty well expounded on here? (edited)

I know I must sound like an angry preacher, but to me the question you asked seems 100 % directly related to that age-old conversation topic

9:56 PM

You were asking about deeply held identity/self-concepts, which is really EXCLUSIVELY what the "teaching" is about

9:57 PM

The TL;DR version of Roger's framework is "when concepts are deeply held as beliefs about who you are, it will invariably result in psychological uncomfortableness"

Unfastened Belts

I know I must sound like an angry preacher, but to me the question you asked seems 100 % directly related to that age-old conversation topic

Please stop hijacking every question I try to ask here with that same old topic. It is incredibly frustrating when I am trying to get others thoughts on something that you keep turning it back into your pet topic.

9:58 PM

If you want to have a conversation on that, by all means do so, but I would prefer if you didn't interrupt my questions to do it.

I'm sorry if I upset you. As I said, I genuinely feel like your question ties in directly with that topic

Personally I'm always down to debate against it; but contextually it may be more prudent to start it up in another channel whilst one line of thought is ongoing. Though that's no longer relevant here since such is done.

Yeah I wasn't trying to use your question as an excuse for changing the conversation, I legitimately felt like "my topic" was directly relevant to the conversation you were trying to have, re: "what happens if my deeply-held self-concepts remain unrealized"

Unfastened Belts

The TL;DR version of Roger's framework is "when concepts are deeply held as beliefs about who you are, it will invariably result in psychological uncomfortableness"

For example this statement. I cannot possibly disagree with a sentiment as much as I disagree with this one

I know Zen, I find it very interesting that we disagree so much haha

10:02 PM

Scarlet let me make up for it by showing you some kinky shit in our private server?!

10:03 PM

Meanwhile Zen I would love for you to explain why you disagree in #general-discussion? :3

Oh gods, that reminds me. I owed someone a link there and completely forgot about it...

Too late, that channel is gonna be aaaall Roger in a minute... :p

10:09 PM

Anyway are you interested in the kinky shit or no!! (edited)

You no I can't say no to that, of course, though I'm curious which direction it is in, lol.

Zen

For example this statement. I cannot possibly disagree with a sentiment as much as I disagree with this one

You and me both.

Dissertation posted.

Zen

Dissertation posted.

WHY

Reasons

So I suppose I'm being desperate here, but I need to get this out of my head:

5:47 PM

My wife made a tulpa without my knowledge.

5:50 PM

We had discussed someone she knows who has a tulpa and switches with him regularly, and I expressed that he's free to do what he wants, but that I wouldn't want to be involved with him. I would think that was fairly clear communication that I don't want my significant other having a tulpa, but she was maybe a week or two into creation (still typing in a text document to force) and she didn't stop, didn't consider that it hurt me.